Gaza War: “This government depends on right-wing extremists”

Many Germans overcome a feeling of fainting when they suffer the suffering in Gaza see. How are you doing?
It is a terrible failure of politics what we see there. Almost three quarters of the German population does not consider Israel’s procedure in Gaza to be justified. The federal government has no answer.

There are demands on the Chancellor to make themselves clear against Israel. How should that fit together with our historical responsibility?
We have to differentiate between the inalienable historical responsibility of Germany towards Israel as a Jewish state and the cooperation with the Netanyahu government. This government depends on racists and right -wing extremists. This differentiation has recently been neglected by the federal government in German politics.

Old Federal President Joachim Gauck recently said: “It is not a genocide for me, but it is an irresponsible action for me.” Do you agree?
The International Court of Justice will decide whether it is genocide, which deals with this question based on the complaint of South Africa. South Africa and Israel have a lot in common. Both emerged from historically terrible, incomparable injustice and have developed into veritable democracies in their regions. The question of whether it is a genocide in Gaza is negotiated in the Haag.

When would you be fulfilled by the accusation of genocide?
There is evidence that the relevant convention of international law could be touched. You can see that the International Criminal Court issued an arrest warrant against Netanyahu on suspicion of crimes against humanity. This is not yet a statement that it is genocide. The court has to clarify everything else.

When we talk about historical responsibility – not right Germany with criticism of the Israeli government?
The fact that Germany bears a special responsibility towards Israel is the basis of our democratic self -image. But this historical responsibility is based on international law. Violations of international law, such as the announced ethnic cleansing in Gaza, are therefore not covered by solidarity with Israel – and also not by the German State Rounds.

The majority of the Israeli population continues to stand behind its government and there are many German Jews who find German criticism of the Israeli approach as well -being.
I know a number of German Jews who criticize Netanyahu’s politics much more clearly than Germans should do. And I know a number of Israelis who accuse her own government of war crimes and speak of genocide as well as apartheid. Netanyahu claims that all those who are against him are anti -Semites. These people are not.

Do we not overestimate our German influence?
Netanyahu will hardly be influenced as long as he has the support from Donald Trump. We shouldn’t fool ourselves. Nevertheless, we need a common European attitude, for example when demanding France and Austria for an immediate ceasefire. The federal government is refusing. The European Federal Foreign Service has determined that Israel questions the foundations of the EU Association Agreement with its procedure. It was very unclear that Germany excluded a suspension before the assessment even existed. We should also have decided together as a European whether we, as a network, recognize the state of Palestine after Netanyahu announced that he wanted to drive away the Palestinians from Gaza. This is a clear rejection of the two-state solution for which the Europeans stand.

What kind of signal would that be to Hamas if Germany would recognize Palestine as a separate state?
First of all, it would be a signal to the Palestinian Authority that we are serious and not to watch our promises if the ethnic cleaning is planned and implemented by entire areas. The Palestinian Authority is our partner, the Hamas our opponent.

Should the Federal Republic still deliver weapons to the state of Israel?
As long as there is a suspicion that these weapons are used for acts contrary to international law, we are not allowed to do so. This is not a question of will. We can’t. Incidentally, this would probably close the gap between large parts of the political elite in Germany and the population. Almost 75 percent of Germans want to limit or suspend arms deliveries to Israel.

Should Germany organize evacuation flights for seriously ill people in Gaza?
This is certainly a successful humanitarian gesture, but it is not yet a policy. Politics must be that the end of the fighting is being pushed. This includes checking and using all instruments.

Does specifically?
We should agree to the explanation for an immediate ceasefire, expose the association agreement between Israel and the European Union and form a coalition of the willing within the EU, which Palestine recognizes as a state.

There are voices that demand sanctions against Israel. How far would you go there?
People who are responsible for massive terror in the West Bank compared to the Palestinian population based there should be sanctioned. Great Britain and France have already launched this and Germany would be very well advised to be in line with them.

Wouldn’t there be very quickly the accusation of glory in the room? Of all things, Germany, which in National Socialism, “does not buy from the Jews” policy, takes part in boycott calls against Israel?
In the current situation, we are talking about settlements that are contrary to international law, and settlers, who terrorize Palestinian inhabitants with arms on their reason. These settlers must not be equated with all Jews.

So far, US President Donald Trump has had the Israeli government granted both in Gaza and in West Bank and sets Netanyahu hardly any limits. What do you expect now?
Donald Trump made it clear through his intervention in Israel’s military striking against Iran that the United States does not want to be dragged into a great war against Iran. But both Trump and Netanyahu have a problem. How should this war be completed? There is no political solution that would be sustainable beyond those for which Europeans have been arguing for some time: that all people between the Jordan and the Mediterranean have a right to life and peace. Palestinians are harassing until other countries absorb them and thus make themselves helpers of ethnic cleaning, I don’t consider a promising recipe. I am convinced that the Arab states will not participate.

Do you see a model of how a Palestinian civilian population can live in the Gaza Strip again?
The prerequisite is Palestine’s recognition as a politically sovereign state and thus recognized interlocutor. What is also necessary for this: that democratic conditions are again established in Palestine using free elections. The last elections were 16 years ago.

Do you seriously believe that this is possible?
This is a very difficult process. Nobody doubts that. Only nobody has shown me a better solution yet.

Doesn’t it have to be part of the German strategy to put pressure on Hamas?
Of course that has to be that way. For example, as a federal government, we have banned the corresponding Hamas-related clubs under the traffic lights.

How about the fact that Hamas unconditionally expires all the hostages that are still in Gaza, including seven with German citizenship, unconditionally?
The hostages have to be released. This requires an armistice. There have only been relevant hostage exemptions in phases of ceasefire. This is how the relatives of the hostages – by the way, supported by former ambassadors of Israel in Germany.

In Israel we experience a society that is extremely unsettled and frightened by the experience of October 7 and at least approves of Netanyahus in large parts. In Gaza, a generation grows that grows up with the destruction of its livelihood and hatred of Israel. Little reason for hope for this conflict, right?
No, but you see, in my political life, except in the United States, I have not been traveling professionally more frequently in the United States than in Israel and Palestine. Every time I thought: it can’t get worse. And then it got worse. There are no simple solutions. Therefore, it is all the more important to focus on the basics. And they are our historical responsibility for the state of Israel, the resulting responsibility for the fate of the Palestinians and the indivisibility of international law.